Moved posts

thudmeizer · Posted: Sun Oct 07, 2007 2:49 am Post subject:

Excellent! Looking forward to seeing how things have progressed.

thudmeizer · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:07 am Post subject:

Ohh What?!?!

How is this good news?

1) All existing assets are DoW1 -- they cannot be exported to CoH -- you are throwing out years of work to a game that still has overly complex Modtools compared to DoW.
2) DoW2 is unknown -- it could very well be locked down like CoH is and basically continues to be.
3) Don't think Relic will automatically allow you to export CoH content to DoW2. On the contrary.. their not dumb. They know all that DoW1 content would look good in DoW2 and unless Buggo can absolutely stifle any concerns about the transition, I would seriously NOT set any expectations for DoW2.

Those recently CoH modtools are complicated and you'll be figuring out how to move things over by the time DoW2 comes out.

I had a bad feeling the DoW2 announcement would start causing talent to move. We don't know what DoW2 will entail.. we have to wait til Buggo suggests to the contrary.

Mind you, Richocet came back to me wanting to mod again for you guys.. now I'm disappointed in this announcement because all that previous work will go down the toilet.

Danimator · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 8:16 am Post subject:

Sorry Thud, but I just can't get motivated over DoW1 anymore and everyhting that can be done for the game has been done now, it all just variations on the same old theme or that's how I see it.

DoW2 will be different, it will be a level playing field for us all, we all have to start from scratch and we all have to learn new stuff, that was what was so much fun in 2004-2006.

From what I have read about DoW2 there will be smaller squads (limited to 6?) and you have to keep this squad alive and develop it through the game so the models and animations will be much more detailed.

This will hopefully mean the mod teams will have to spend more time on just one or two really good units rather than trying to make dozens of different ones.

So yep, it does mean throwing away all that work but it was a great experience and it will all help in the future.

CoH is more complicated but there lies the challenge, the tools are coming out at last and lets see if models finally start appearing now that the OE is finally out (even if no-one seems to have figured it out yet).

We've got pushing two years to get used to the CoH engine now so by then we should be able to do a few trhings with it and maybe models won't be able to be taken straight from CoH to DoW2 but a bit of time getting used to the max and OE side of CoH should be worthwhile.

As for Ricocet, nice to see him back but he is way out of touch with DoW now so he will struggle to get up to speed with it at a guess. He emailed me and I replied but have heard nothing since.

There is no team left here Thud, no interest in what we were doing so no chance of this work being resurrected. I can't even get interested in Soulstorm and it's the first DoW game I haven't bothered to buy.

I downloaded the demo for Daniel but I've not even looked at it myself, that's how interested I am now, sorry.

DoW2 is the only way I can get my interest back, that's why it's good news for me. Hopefully you will start work on the AI for CoH (if you haven't already) so you're ready for DoW2 AI next year.

See you there I hope Smile

_________________

"Golf widows have it easy"

thudmeizer · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:27 pm Post subject:

Well then you have no choice - you need to have someone else "carry the torch" because all those people over the 3+ years of swet, blood, and toil to get finished the 6+ factions you and Grim did will be counting on seeing all that work realized on our HDDs.

Grim regrettably doesn't answer emails reliably since last summer (not sure what thats all about) so his projects are sitting idle doing nothing. IronWarriors can be evolved via Heretic. The others need a home, badly!

Its up to you to quickly get the word out -- another team must continue to finish this work because it'll never get done and the obligation is there from all modders who helped you to see this become reality AT LEAST in the form of a public beta.

I can organize this if you wish because its my shear passion to see a high percentage projects in the community done to a fair point before I move to DoW2 in mid-to-late '09.

Can we work towards this in the next week? We owe it to everyone who has given such incredible amounts of time to seeing these projects through. Getting a hold of Grim would also help. Thank you dear sir.

Danimator · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:49 pm Post subject:

To be honest I don't really feel under any obligation to anyone for work put into the Mods. They all knew what they were doing when they worked on the mods and they all left for one reason or another. If they were really bothered about seeing the mods realised they would have stayed.

Chainz and Stevo, possible Mel did some great work in the early days and some of that is still there, but I have no idea who did what. Grim may know and we did and do appreciate what they did and good work it was too, but I don't feel an obligation to finish the mod because of this and I'm sure they understand this isn't meant as a slight of any kind.

On the contrary, I was really hoping Stevo was going to help me with BL as I'm a big fan of his work (the BL landraider was/is awesome) but he had other commitments with BA and a certain kitchen extention Wink

From talks with Grim I'm fairly sure he feels the same way and wouldn't want the mods handed over to anyone else to finish. They're our mods and if we don't finish them then they don't get finished.

So thanks for the offer, but we're not looking for anyone to carry on our work in any shape or form. It wouldn't then be our work any more which really would make it a waste of time. Shame, but there you go.
_________________

"Golf widows have it easy"

thudmeizer · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:18 pm Post subject:

Well honestly that sounded a little selfish didn't it? So the rally ends on the track with no one around being asked to pick up the torch to finish the race? You are not even going to bother asking the community that this is where the project(s) stand, do we have any takers who will do these 3+ years of work justice?

You and Grim are basically making a statement of resignation and are thus foregoing the fact there is an avenue towards finishing these works BUT because you feel no one is worthy OR bother to take the FINAL STEP of effort to advertise the imminent demise of these project, that 3+ years of work are essentially dead.

What kind of rationale decision is this? The work is of course yours and Grims but what was it worth to you? Those days and nites.. Was it not a labour of love enough that if you felt it was time to give up that you'd hear a voice in your conscious saying: "boy, what was my reward in all these years if it had never reached any one's drive? What is my legacy?"

What is your legacy if a project you worked hard for never sees the light or can be handed down to your successor with explicit instructions (aka. Dark Eldar project when Tyco could not go any farther)? What an utter waste if all those DE assets were lost in the ether? No.. Tyco assigned Alf to look after all assets and then we assigned a team. Now the project is healthier then its ever been.

Think about it, Mark.. plezz.. I invested time in these projects all last year and know the transition will work as it did with DE.

TuD.

Danimator · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:27 pm Post subject:

H.mm, I've started a reply a couple of times but don't really see the point as we're never going to agree.

This is just how I feel and it's not going to change. It's also a case of leaving options open as it is possible we'll want to take up where we left off at some point in the future, something that can't be done if we hand over all our work to some-one else. After 3 years of work I don't think that this is unreasonable.

Grim made himseld fairly clear in his last post on Relic, I haven't heard from him for about 8 weeks, but we have to assume that without hearing to the contary his postion remains the same.
_________________

"Golf widows have it easy"

thudmeizer · Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:42 pm Post subject:

There is a SLIM chance we *might* be able to export all DoW content to DoW2 but thats not confirmed. On April10th the there afterwards we will get a clearer picture what expectations will be via Buggo.

I would just like to think all the AI I coded for you guys won't get wasted. You do realize all 5+ mod projects you and Grim worked on work in SoulStorm?

Btw, is there any chance of getting the last BlackLegion build just so that it can be AI coded? I know I don't have SpaceWolves but instead have 13th Company. You did have BL almost ready for AI but.. well.. ball is in your court of course. Wink